Categories
Kuwait News

Kuwait said to revive alcohol decision

KUWAIT CITY, Nov 2: The Ministry of Commerce and Industry has activated decision No. 614/1967 which allows foreigners, who enter Kuwait on tourist visas and stay in five-star hotels, to consume alcohol, reports Al-Shahed daily. Sources said alcohol will be served in specially allocated places and the guests will not be allowed to drink in public places. MP Waleed Al-Tabtabaei reacted to the report, saying “it is either a joke or certain parties are testing waters to see if the idea will work.” Speaking to reporters Tuesday, Al-Tabtabaei said “the Ministry of Commerce and Industry has denied all such reports and added that it did not issue any such circular in 1977.” [Source]

Kuwait Times predicted this 3 years ago [Link]

240 replies on “Kuwait said to revive alcohol decision”

This is the best news I’ve heard in a long while in regards to Kuwait’s policy makers!!! Fooooking HELLL YAH! Legalize it~ Don’t criminalize it~

It’s one step closer to the real thing for us Kuwaiitis. Kind of like Cali’s medicinal herb (other states followed in its path, legalizing medicinal herb) then prop 19 recently. Sad outcome, but at least the number of voters that support the cause are increasing. Hopefully we can see that with alcohol.

Buy a 12pack of beer, place it into a ice cooler… yeah, your mouth is watering now.

NO. Dont do it. It’s better on the black market.

This is just a money ploy. This way the elite will hold monopoly on liquor permit and make more money.
Atleast on the Black market the money is distributed to huslters who need the money

Why is it that Johnny can walk as far up the Gulf as Qatar but they stop him at the border of Kuwait – even though he owns a home here? hmmmmmm.

Yes ‘Realist’ because a drink of alcohol will definitely send the tourists on a massive raping spree.

What a massively dense statement. Are you 4 years old?

why just bedouins? think about any drunk youngsters in the steets? even today it is scary to drive thru gulfroad during daytime… eve teasing, talking each other between the cars and a lot of things are done by the youngsters of both gender… cant think about they getting drunk…

i dont get why “alcoholics” in kuwait r having a mini heart attack and tears of joy and happiness streaming down their faces over this…as if they cant find alcohol NOW..

i’d just like to say..and im happy to burst ur bubbles..but this will NEVER happen…for many social, political, and religious issues…i dont expect most expats to understand them..

but hey it doesnt hurt to dream right? i just wish u guys would be more ambitious and dream about something more worthy and substantial..

“cheers”

I just love it when people jump the gun and start talking like they’ve done their research on a subject.

PEOPLE…IT IS FOR PEOPLE WITH A TOURIST VISA!!!!

which means that Kuwaitis WON’T be getting it. Other than that, I also love how people are afraid that “kuwaitis” and others will just rush to bars and start Pinkberry-like lines to get drunk!!! WHAT THE FUCK PEOPLE!!

Are we really all that desperate?!Massive raping sprees and I dont know what?! Intaw min sijkom?! DO we not all have self control at all?

I don’t know about some people, but as a Kuwaiti< I don't like being classififed in that way. I like to think that I can control myself and that I have borders and I'm sure most of you will agree that such statements of "mass rape" and other shit is just asinine for we are not animals.

I think the people that are making these wild and crazy claims are the first ones to go and get hammered because one sees others in his behavior.

Passing a law that’s as devisive as this would cause civil discontentment or even unrest, sorry to burst your bubble but the majority of kuwaitis don’t want alcohol to be legal. I can’t see such a divisive law like this being passed especially with the political climate of the last couple of years with the majles being shutdown every 2 years. It would polarize the nation and therefore would never be passed.

@tweez offcourse the whole raping spree stuff is just exageration, but what we can’t deny is increase in DUI and vehicular homicide due to drinking.

Why is it when an Islamic country follows Islamic values they’re referred to as being ‘in the dark ages’ and ‘behind times’?

Conforming to the desires of the masses doesn’t make something right.

If you want to drink, take a flight, visit another country, or don’t move to Kuwait.

America isn’t going to prohibit alcohol because Muslims live there — why should Kuwait allow it because non-Muslims live here?

Funny — this isn’t about population, this is about the citizens of the country.

And America is comprised of over 33% Muslims of those who claim a religion.

Bottom line; expats are here to work, not make the laws.

We don’t allow non-citizens to vote and make laws in America, why should Kuwait be expected to?

Mr. Pete… do you think the black market hustlers are independent? They all report to the big honchos who control the illegal liquor trade

I think alcohol sales in Kuwait, if strictly controlled, won’t be the disaster that all the religious doomsayers above think it will be

American girl. Are u saying there are 100m Muslims in America ?

You have been to America right?

It seems you’re just making numbers up to back up your disastrous argument.

Funny, I am stating 33% of individuals who claim a religious sect are Muslims — yes. This does not equal 100m.

I won’t respond to your silly rhetorical question in which the answer is obvious.

Why is it so difficult to accept Kuwait is an Islamic country? Making changes which violate the Sharia to accommodate the expats? And I’m the one with the disastrous argument?

American girl, please show us a single link that states 33% of America are Muslims.

We look forward to this substantial evidence.

It’s already difficult driving in Kuwait. Actually it’s difficult to shop ! How many times you saw a bloody fight in the Avenues ? Add alcohol to the equation and you might want to wrap the whole place with a yellow tape.

For those that don’t understand the point of an exaggeration need to chill and visualize the whole scene for a second. That being said limiting it to tourist in their rooms is just as stupid. Tourist see drinking as a lifestyle enhancer, such as having a margarita at the beach. They don’t want to be locked up in a room while they do it. It’s not a heroin shot !

I suggest they do cheap shuttle flights to Bahrain.

Funny, reading comprehension escapes you this morning?

I’ll repeat — 33% of Americans WHO CLAIM A RELIGIOUS SECT are Muslims. This number doesn’t include the Americans who are of NO religion — which is more than likely a higher number than those who are.

Love your attempt at ‘spinning’, Funny. Unfortunately you’re failing miserably.

____________

Spartan, that’s very kind, thank you so much. I’m generally attacked for not following the expat masses which often want to impose a Western lifestyle onto a Muslim country for their personal comfort and convenience. As you see.

i think the number of muslims in the states is irrelevant..this is kuwait…and the constitution clearly states that it is a muslim country..im assuming that the ppl who wrote that didn’t specify the country’s religion for shits and giggles..

at the end of the day, all proponents of legalizing alcohol can do is bitch and moan over how backward kuwait is cuz OH MY GOD u can’t get shit faced in this country..well boohoo for u..cry me a river..build a bridge..and get over it..cuz alcohol will never be legalized in this country =D

using ur faulty logic -and im using the term “logic” loosely- if alcohol is what kuwait is lacking in order to get out of the “dark ages”, then legalizing prostitution and allowing the proliferation of drugs will rocket us into the 22nd century ahead of everyone else on the planet..

“CHEEEERS”

American girl

Please post a link backing up your facts.

If you can’t (and we already know you wont) please quit whilst you’re already way behind.

American girl, i totally understand believe me and thats why im in awe of what u wrote..i take off my hat, take a japanese bow, and raise my head band to you!

Bravo, Spartan. I agree 100%. Kuwait is Kuwait — period. And thank you 🙂

Funny, I’m not your secretary — do your own demographic search if you’re that interested. However, get your calculator out as you’re obviously going to need it. Demographics are done using an the entire population of the USA. You’ll need to remove those of ‘no religion’ from your equation to get an accurate calculation.

Tweez i did not say islamic…i said the constitution says that it is a MUSLIM country..for YOUR information..at least quote me right

the second article of the constitution stipulates:

“دين الدولة الاسلام والشريعة الاسلامية مصدر رئيسي للتشريع”

@Tweez

ur objection was about me saying that kuwait’s is a muslim country..no one said anything about Shariaa..i merely quoted the entire second article which so happens to mention it…im guessing its the first time u read the second article since “kuwait’s religion is islam” seems like news to u

@ american girl loool thanks..i get that alot!! kidding 😛

@ Tweez what makes u think i dont understand arabic?? is it the fact that i taught u something new about kuwait?? yes, our constitution says that kuwait’s religion is ISLAM…i appreciate ur embarrassment, its ok..and dont try to switch this into a debate over the interpretation of “والشريعة الاسلامية مصدر رئيسي للتشريع” cuz any idiot who passed first grade can tell u that it obviously doesnt mean that Shariaa is the ONLY source of legislation but that its merely A main source of legislation..

aaaaaaaall of that does not reverse what i said: Kuwait’s religion is ISLAM =D

Tweez ما عليك زود

أهم شيء إنك اليوم تعلمت شيء يديد..كل يوم تعال لي عشان أعلمك

since u evidently did not even have the luxury of going to the first grade

american girl…sorry about that..the arabic text is a quote from the constitution – second article..it translates into:

“The religion of the State is Islam, and the Islamic Shariaa is a main source for legislation”

Most Muslim countries DO allow alcohol in one way or another.Either to everyone, or only to expats, or in a controlled environment. Kuwait is one of the few countries in the world that bans it outright.This includes places like Indonesia that has 200 million muslims living there and places like Syria,Egypt,Lebanon and countless others.

Banning alcohol here has never stopped anyone from drinking : from the cheap KD 5 bottles of Sadiki that the entire worker population drinks, to the KD 50 a bottle that everyone else drinks.

Kuwait has one of the most vibrant alcohol black markets in the world and legalising it would control and organise the import and distribution of it and would also generate income for the government.

Finally, since as muslims we are promised rivers of wine if and when we get to heaven,surely alcohol cant be that bad for us? 😉

American Girl: The percentage of muslims in USA is 0.8% of the population as per 2009 PEW Report but some Islamic sources claim is as high as 2%. So let’s take it as 2% for argument’s sake. As per Washington Post Survey done in 2009, 15% of Americans say they have no religion i.e. 85% have some religion. Discounting the 15% people having no religion and assuming that no muslim figures in the list, the population of muslims among US populace who say they belong to some religion is 2/0.85= 2.35%. Where did you get your 33%?

American Girl,

I’m glad you publicly humiliated yourself with your ‘substantial evidence’ claim.

Enjoy reading the below estimates….

https://www.religioustolerance.org/isl_numb.htm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_the_United_States

The estimated number of Muslims in the US ranges between 1.3 – 7 million across 5 different sources.

For your premise to be correct; that 33% of the practicing population of the US are muslim

– that would equate to between 3m to 20m people out of 307 million Americans follow any religious faith.

Embarrassing.

Like I said, quit whilst you’re way behind – or you’ll have to come back as a different poster.

the fuss might be about people who dont know their constitution and dont know that the religion of kuwait is ISLAM….im just sayin! 😛

bazaar “surely” cant be that bad?? if u really believe that then its time for u to pick up a bood and educate urself..start with the quraan since u say ur a muslim

It’s cute Rosy quotes PEW, which is an independent polling group offering no evidence of accuracy.

Referring to the US Census, which I believe can be considered a bit more reliable than PEW, no? I mean seriously. Unfortunately, the Census hasn’t asked about religion since the mid-50’s, which distorts the more recent numbers. However, add in the most recent (and semi-accurate number) provided by the State Department in 2001, include the growth rate through 2010, and there you have it.

Again, I’m not your secretary, Funny. Though it’s amusing how the internet will provide enough nonsense for anyone to use as evidence to support their hate filled diatribes.

Next we can debate alien life forms living in your backyard — surely you can pull something from Google to support that as well.

PEW? Seriously? LOL, good try.

American Girl,

This is getting painful. You’re so down, I feel sorry for you.

“Though it’s amusing how the internet will provide enough nonsense for anyone to use as evidence to support their hate filled diatribes.”

Are you suggesting that:

American Religious Identification Survey
Pew Research Center
Encyclopedia Britannica
U.S. News & World Report
Council on American-Islamic Relations

Are all wrong?

You’re a joke.

Funny, I’m suggesting it’s killing you the growth of Islam in America is higher than any other religion. Or that the population of Islam in America has more than doubled since 2001.

I venture to say you would be far more amusing after a few drinks at the local bar. Isn’t that the topic of the conversation at hand? Or did you get lost on Google?

You can’t.

You’ve provided links to 5 sites which rely upon one another for statistics. None of which are government agencies responsible for accuracy.

‘A’ for effort — but pretend-a-facts are no solid foundation in a debate.

Wow, so Funny, you honestly had NOTHING better to do but to sit and make sure you prove someone wrong? Make your OWN point by supporting your claims; discrediting someones claims doesn’t prove your point.

I’ll let your words speak loud, American Girl.

“If I don’t understand it, I figure it out. I just refuse to give up. Nothing can beat me!

Until now…

Math wins. I’m defeated. I admit… I just don’t get it.”

Thanks for pointing out you’re clueless with numbers, not that that wasn’t apparent from your first post.

wen ga3deeeeeeeen!!!! abaih wallah galbi gam e3awirni!!! it’s so sad wallah!!! enshallah they don’t approve it..

This has got to be one of the most entertaining blogs yet on 248am! You guys had us rollin with your arguement! Thanks for making our day better Funny, American Girl, Spartan, and Tweez! Legalize it or not, it won’t bother me because if they don’t Bahrain is just a 50 minute flight away!

“Kuwait has one of the most vibrant alcohol black markets in the world and legalising it would control and organise the import and distribution of it and would also generate income for the government.”

That would be considered haram money.

Give it a rest American Girl. You are so obviously wrong about your figures that it’s just laughable. 33% of Americans who claim a religious belief are Muslim? What planet are you from?

Othman, you’re very sweet, thank you.

I’m starting to think Funny and David are related to ‘Adam’, another one of my ‘fun’ stalkers who followed my blog from here. Though Adam was ‘classy’ enough to make death threats — either of you game?

And, Funny, the fact you read my blog would be flattering if reading comprehension were something you had a better grasp of. I suspect you had your thesaurus in one hand and your… well, nevermind.

Off topic but..
@Sfsa78
Even if you considered Scientology to be a religion, which is debatable, “percentage” is misleading, since their members are relatively few in numbers. If you started a religion and were able to convert another person, well that’s a 100% increase right there.

why is everyone assuming alcohol is haram? Drinking and the hijab are 2 of the most controversial topics in the entire quran since a lot of muslims believe differently than what is commonly accepted (which was handed down to us by some bearded freaks with no formal eduation and 4 wives!)

American girl. I’ve never heard of you or your blog.

You’ve been found out badly and just look like a sad, desperate fool now.

@American Girl
Don’t flatter yourself – I don’t follow your blog and have no idea why anyone would given your posts on here.
Unsurprised to see that you are back to your usual insults. Presumably, it is your attempt to distract from the nonsense you post.

American Girl: The Earth is flat.
Everyone else: Err, no it isn’t, and here is a very long list of reputed scientific links to prove it….
American Girl: You can’t believe the information there. I’m far more knowledgeable on this. You should do your own research like I did.
Everyone else: Please point us to your sources.
American Girl: I’m not your secretary.

I dont think legalizing it is gonna be a good idea. I think many families wouldnt want to know that their govt is making money by selling alcohol to their children, or around them, especially when it is haram in islam.

and like othman said… any money made from alcohol is considered haram money.. and the govt gives the people many benefits, and if some of the money for these benefits is from alcohol, its just one sin over another over another, with the cycle going on and on… maybe now its being done in the blackmarket and might help, but what one doesnt know causes no harm

oh.. and maybe alcohol was allowed back in the 60s, but i think the old generation was probably much more mature than this generation

yes..more mature inden..especially in conparison to the kindergarten drop outs we have today, who dont even know that the constitution says that kuwait’s religion is ISLAM =D

@American Girl.

Try again. Reading comprehension obviously isn’t your strong point. I am not that poster.

And before you say it, no we are not the same person. Amazingly enough, there are plenty of people on here who can see that what you are posting is ridiculous. But I guess that we should all just ignore the nonsense you try to pass off as fact. You said that 33% of Americans with a religious affiliation are Muslim. That is so laughably inaccurate that I don’t know how you could have even contemplated posting it in the first place let alone tried to defend your position. Why not own up to your error? It’s not that difficult.

It is just me or is it a pattern that American girl gets attacked almost every time she posts something?

I enjoy a few short debates myself from time to time (been in one or two), but this seems more like a personal fighting zone than anything, especially with the insults, name calling and what not.

Personally I don’t see anything wrong with this, especially since it’s targeted to a specific group (tourists). but like she said, you have to put a country’s culture in mind. If the natives don’t want this, they don’t want this.

Diesel,
Scientology is a religion… All religions are basically belief in superstition and the supernatural. Diesel.. You do not have the right or the monopoly on religious belief.

@Nael,
I don’t have a problem with banning alcohol. That is a choice for the citizens/leaders of this country to make and doesn’t elicit any strong response from me either way (unlike say the stoning to death of a woman for adultery would if that was actually allowed).
I simply have an issue with someone posting blatant inaccuracies and not admitting to it.

@Spartan
its people like you that make others hate Islam or any other religion for that matter.

So, if you’re thinking that you are gaining “7asanaat” or scoring points with Allah by insulting others then you need to think again about what you’re doing.

you know whats funny? Some people here think once alcohol is legal in Kuwait, we’ll see accidents and orgies all over the place.

My question is, has anyone been to the GCC countries where alcohol is legal? UAE for example has the most respectful people I have ever met. I don’t see accidents on a massive scale and nor do I see massive “raping sprees”. And I can say the same for Bahrain and Qatar. But why is it that when it comes to Kuwait people get this End of Days image that all hell will break loose? Ishda3wa….lay hal daraja ga7a6 ya3ni?!

To booze or not to booze…. That is the question? I think that allowing alcohol to expats and non Muslims should be allowed just like in America laws have been bent to accommodate Muslims and other religions. I hate how we should accept everyone’s rights and beliefs but if in Kuwait live under Kuwait. We should say the same if in USA stop changing our laws and live or leave despite giving birth to get our USA passport!

Or we can all fight for our rights wherever we are living in the world! Just a thought!

I’ve been living UAE for 6 years and coming back to Kuwait to visit my friends and family. In all honesty it is much safer to drive in the UAE than it is in Kuwait and they have alcohol over there. Do I see drunken Emarties every single day walking in the street causing havoc to woman or drive like mad men under the influence of alcohol? No I don’t. In fact they can control themselves, have self respect and a choice whether they choose to drink or not. Can’t we do the same? Does that mean as a Kuwaiti if alcohol was to be legalized am I going to go berserk, punching random people, raping women and do all this damage? I have my own self respect and I am sure others too. Shame on you people for labeling us in not having self control. For God sakes as other members on this blog have posted that other gulf regions like Lebanon, Bahrain Egypt etc have alcohol legal and they can control themselves and are well respected people. You guys are acting like that it’s the end of the Kuwait if alcohol was to be legalized. Bare in mind that this is only for expats with a VALID VISA and not for locals! Grow up!

Bottom line..
Do you honestly believe that the new Messila hotel will make revenue without tourist wanting to come to Kuwait? Wanting in meaning we have something ells to offer them than sand and orange juice?

What about Al Hamra? Silk city? The amount of money at stake is beyond our little pity fight about religion. Either you like it or not money walk and do the talk in Kuwait.

Expansion of the airport? Kuwait is and will plan to move out of the time zone it is in right now.
Wine is culture, bring it on…=)

Bazaar you rule…
American girl… go to sleep it is way beyond your bedtime.

This is exactly whats wrong with this country. People can’t have an argument men gher 6oolt lsan ;/

If you’re truly a muslim and think drinking is haram, i’m sure u wont need the government to make that choice for you. Dont Drink! wayed sa3ba? ;p Do u all get drunk wetkharbe6oon when u travel? cuz lo chethi elsalfa el3aib feekom :p

Allow booze.. Tax it heavily… Use tax to build some damn hospitals!! Win win situation!!
Who here agrees with me?

religion and politics do not belong together.
The rest of the world has figured it out…about time Kuwait gets it.

@Sfsa78
Now this is peculiar. Please point out where I gave any opinion on any belief or claimed a monopoly on any religious belief?
Lets try this again: considering Scientology to be a religion is debatable. That’s not an opinion; that’s simply a fact. For your info, several countries don’t consider Scientology to be a religion, including Germany. Again, not my opinion, but a fact. Comprende now?

I’m against legalizing Alcohol, But let me just say this, American Girl, You are the worst debater I’ve seen, ever.

You bring out claims without citing sources, you discredit others sources with no evidence that they are fallacious, you personally insult others, compare them to an irrelevant stalker who has nothing to do with this, nor have they shown any interest in your personal life to compare them in that way, and then try to get out of this debate by using a completely pathetic and childish “Oh you’re in love with me, that means I win the debate, bye!” which doesn’t have anything to do with said debate. You contribute nothing to this discussion and try to use emotion where logic is needed.

Logically, I’d rather alcohol not be legal in Kuwait. Ignore the fact that alcohol is banished in Islam. The people of Kuwait are a very addictive people, We have one of highest rates of obesity and a high prevalence of smoking, adding alcohol to the mix wouldn’t bode well to our overall health, as a large number of us aren’t very responsible (Although I will acknowledge there would be people who would drink responsibly). And please don’t take me as an anti-Kuwaiti type of person, I would love nothing more than to see my country’s people be more responsible and less corrupt, but I’m not seeing it. Back on topic, in addition to increased traffic accidents (To our already bad track record) we’d also be opening a whole new health dilemma of failing livers, and increased misconduct in public (Again, bad track record with that as well).

Anyway, I respect your viewpoint Funny Story, and hope that you will respect mine, but encourage you to debate me in the matter in a logical manner so we can come to a better conclusion.

Deisel..
So if scientology isn’t a religion, what is it.. A form of transportation?
if its debatable, then any religion is debatable.
Scientology is a form of faith/belief system.. I think it is you that does not comprehend.
All form of faith are belief in the supernatural, and make belief.
1+1=2.. You don’t need faith or emAan to believe in that.

And yet again…

Alcohol money is haram. Having the government tax alcohol and then use that money to pay people is haram.

How many of you know that there are quite a few counties in the US that don’t allow the public consumption or sale of alcohol? The number of “dry” counties varies from state to state. In Kentucky, for example, 55 of the 120 countries are dry while in Mississippi, half of the state’s counties are dry. The entire United States was “dry” during the Prohibition Era which lasted from 1920 to 1933. So it’s not just Muslim countries that prohibit the consumption and sale of alcohol!

Tourists do not come to Kuwait for tourism proposes !! in fact there is nothing interesting for them here, they come only for their jobs or related stuffs.
instead, it is better if they do something to increase the tourism in Kuwait.

First of all, Amercian girl *clap* I’m really amazed.
As for Tweez and Funny, get over it guys. She’s right so please learn to respect that and admit that you are wrong. Btw Funny, is David your tag-team partner? Srsly

K, if you had read the thread from the beginning you would see my debate was strictly about the sale and legalization of alcohol in Kuwait.

It was my ‘frind’ Funny who then strayed off into the world of utter nonsense — totally unrelated to the topic at hand. Incessantly and non-stop even, hence the ‘you love me’ comment. It was facetious. Did you think I was serious? Good grief.

Additionally, I cited two sources which support the statements I made. Whether or not he chose to seek it out is on him. Though I’m convinced he’s more a “Googler” and less a fact finder. I didn’t leave the debate — I left the house. Weekend, plans… you know.

Now, back to the topic — the ONLY reason I feel selling alcohol in Kuwait would be the wrong decision is because it’s haram money going to the government, in turn being used to improve the country — with that same haram money. But in reality, if alcohol were legal (for everyone, not just tourists), initially you’re going to see a higher rate of accidents and crime. But once the novelty wears off and the children know candy is readily available — they’re not going to want it as badly. With the exception of a few.

Kwt to revive alcohol decision….and it’s about time too.

At the very least, legalize alcopops and non alcoholic beer. You can even drink it in the Forbidden Kingdom (KSA) for God’s sake but for some odd reason, it was taken off the shelves sometime back in this holier-than-thou nation.

No matter what people think of alcohol, a blanket ban on alcohol is doing more damage than it is good. For one thing, Kwt constantly keeps bumping off the MICE radar partly due to that, besides making it very difficult for headhunters to retain top notch Western middle and senior level management who bring with them a much valued skill set and who also look to a better quality of life and living which they can easily find next door working in the Emirates, Bahrain, Oman or Qatar.
I am not making a case for lifting the ban en masse but liquor served to those with permits in 5 star hotels and clubs will, for one thing, rev up the dining and going out scene in Kwt.

American girl: You are pathetic. You belittle everyone who do not agree with you but offer no proof to support your argument. You say PEW data is not accurate, fine. But their data was merely shown in my post but I depended on Islamic sources for my arguments. For example, Council of American-Islamic relations (CAIR) cites a figure of 7 million muslims in US in 2010 (2.27%). Now, let us look at the official figures from the Govt, see https://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/2010/tables/10s0075.pdf
From 228 million adult population in US in 2008, around, 1.3 million calls themselves muslims (0.5%). Out of the total population, around 12 million did not respond to the survey and another 34 million did not specify any religion. If we deduct these from the total population, number of adult Americans who responded as believing in some religion is 182 million of which 1.3 million are muslims. Do your maths- percentage of muslims among adherents of any religion in US is a mere 0.7%. Someone must be completely out of his/ her mind to quote a figure of 33%.

@ TweeZ:

1- ppl who “hate” islam have a predetermined prejudice against it..theyre not waiting for me to make up their mind for them..

2- what is it exactly that im doing that would make ppl “hate” islam??

3- it is not my problem if u have already made the assumption that im a long-bearded fundamentalist..ماني مطوع…consequently, i have no interest in addressing whatever subsequent assumptions uve made based on the first assumption..

4- i neither have the itention nor the inclination to change the ignorant people’s perception about islam…كيفهم

5- i like how ur trying to divert the attention away from ur embarrassment by trying to make this about something bigger than urself…its cute and so 4 year old of u..awwww

Rosy, the fact you continue to argue the numnber of Muslims in America almost scares me. Do you hate it that much?

The 1.3 million who refer to themselves as Muslim is an inaccurate number as there’s no current (government regulated) census which does a religious sect headcount. My number of 33% comes from several reports which gather their figures using the last US Census which asked about religion in the 1950’s and the rate at which Islam has grown in American through 2010 (based on US State Department reporting).

In reality, none of us have an EXACT number of Muslims in America. This I willingly admit. However, I am certain my 33% is far closer to accurate than your 0.7% which you continue to pull from websites with zero government affiliation.

Finally, this post was about the legalization of alcohol in Kuwait — and from reading some replies on this thread — I’m starting to think it’s a GREAT idea. You people need a drink!

@American Girl,

You are still arguing a point that is so obviously wrong it beggars belief.
Rosy’s original response where she stated a figure of 2.35%, and which used actual published data (rather than plucked from someone’s imagination) and high end population estimates, is clearly a generous assessment of the figures. Your 33% figure has been shown to be utter nonsense, yet you still keep going. Even the 0.7% figure Rosy mentions above is quite obviously far closer to the truth than your numbers and yet you make completely the opposite argument.
Nobody is claiming EXACT figures, but you keep stating that your percentage is based on actual reputed sources. Why not post up the links? I’ll tell you why… because they don’t exist.

I think I can speak only for myself I am an expat living and working here for over a year , and in all honesty I have seen alot of Kuwaitis drunk alot of other expats drunk from all over but also kuwait is the only place I feel safe with a wad of cash in pocket not even back in the states I felt this safe . what I’m tyring to say is anyone can find ways of getting booze here so if they legalize it or not it still is here . muslim or not they still drink it I for one prefer to go were I can party legally and have a good time for example Qatar . but well I’m not a drunken alcoholic who needs it every day . be safe is all I can say

American Girl: Data I quoted above is from US Census Bureau (https://www.census.gov/) which is an official government site (.gov) and not from somewhere which zero govt. affiliation as you allege. Please try to be reasonable in your arguments. A final question: Have you ever been to the US?

Rosy, considering the US Census hasn’t asked about religious affiliation since the 1950’s, how do you take that ONE number and call it ‘evidence’? It’s rhetorical — let’s not bother ourselves.

Been to America? Me? No, why? LOL. Surely you jest.

American Girl: The data is published in the oficial website of the US Census Bureau. It was obtained directly by them and not through an outside agency. Hence it is considered authentic.

Here in the UAE we don’t have a lot of problems and alcohol is widely available. I find it strange how Kuwaiti’s consider their own people like wild animals.

American girl, you are one of the worst posters I have read on a blog. You talk crap. Sorry

@ moe jr. Koran has been allowed to be used to be sworn in over the bible. Mosques are allowed wherever churches are allowed within zoning laws. Kuwait has rejected building more churches even tho there is enough expats to fill them. Also if you are a Muslim you are allowed take your holy days off. My school won’t allow Christmas off or Easter unless an Islamic holiday falls in those days. If I do take Christmas off my school does not accept sick days and we are deducted 3 days instead of 1. I am nit even allowed to wear green or red during Christmas season. Against the law but nothing we can do about it. That is just to show how USA laws are there for everyone and Muslims do have rights in USA but although we should have rights here, trying fighting for them against a Kuwaiti here! So allowing booze shouldn’t be a problem if it’s worked out ok in Bahrain and UAE etc. I have been going to this countries for 9 years and the only bar fight I have ever seen was one by Saudi boys and another by Kuwaiti group!

I don’t understand why the hell the threads are getting hijacked by American Girl all the time… Yes she has a point and ppl get on with it. It might be non-sense for many of you.. but do you respond to all the non-sense you hear… guys n gals.. please focus on the main topic and have a healthy discussion and debate. Agree to disagree on topics… and lets not bring hate into this community.

David, Rosy, Funny : you guys either are crazy or to much against islam to counter every point what american girl is raising

Spartan : respect and agree your views that Kuwait is a Muslim country and I presume it is the same for other GCC countries…If not all, most of the expats knows about it.

Regarding the alcohol, legalizing will only reduce the cost of alcohol in Kuwait, as it already exists in the market. Estimates indicates that around 1 million dinars are made per container by the importers/smugglers. When Johny walks thru the borders his price goes up to 50 KD from about 5 KD a margin of 45 KD.. wow… 2-3 hands might be changed before it goes to the end user. once in a while you hear about the alcohol container is ceased by the customs authorities… not every time it passes by… but on a daily basis you hear about the locally made alcohol (yes, the 5KD stuff)…

It doesn’t matter to me if it is legal or not as I do not use it. But it will bring down the price and might slightly increase the usage. As long as it is controlled, it should be fine.

No offense to anyone

guys did you even bother reading everything.
Its ony in the hotels, and only 5 stars hotel.
Only for Tourist people with Tourist Visa.
so it does not make sense.

they will not sell to kuwaiti people.
because they are residence of this country.

think for a second here.
Bahrain people, or gulf arab people cant drink, because they can come to kuwait wihtout TOURIST VISA, because they are ARABS.
now if your taking about phillipinos,indians,and other nationalitys, thats a diffrent, story, because going to a 5 star hotel, and the drinks might be expensive, and i doubt some of them can afford it, so its only for the business people.
now lets get this straight even without alcohol, you got crazy drivers killing one another. So that doesnt make any sense at all.have you seen the way people drive in KUWAIT??!?
its a small country but its DEADLY!

@Indian,
I am neither crazy nor against Islam.

We are not responding to every point that American Girl is making – we are countering the single ludicrous falsehood that she is peddling over and over again. But please feel free to explain to me why countering nonsense with actual facts and figures makes someone crazy/against Islam.

American Girl is free to produce evidence to support her arguments. She doesn’t because she can’t, so why does she persist? Presumably because she is incapable of ever admitting to being wrong even in the most glaring of examples.

@maud
i never did say that I wanted alcohol to be legalized. I am being a devil’s advocate. Ans as fasr as my stance goes on the subject I’m nuetral. Whether its legalized or not it will not make a difference because it here and will always be here.

@spartan
it is obvious that you have nothing constructive to say and never did. Maybe one day when you’re old enough to comprehend what others are saying and not take things too seriously….you just might make sence of the world you live in.

Q, thank you, that’s so sweet.

Indian… I agree completely! My intent is never to ‘hijack’ the post — but it seems my commentary engenders insanity. My apologies, truly.

I say get these people a drink immediately.

American Girl: I think people are just curious to where you got your figure that 33% of the US are Muslim. You still haven’t provided a single link to a source while others here have provided various links all with similar answers. Could you just end this argument once and for all by just providing a link?

@Spartan
you know what else is funny and sad at the same time? Most of your comments here are about you correcting yourself. 9ij yahil

@American Girl,
It doesn’t engender insanity, it engenders irritation. You aren’t posting a minor factual inaccuracy. You are pushing a figure that is more than FIFTEEN TIMES greater than the highest estimate that can be found from any reputable source.
But hey, I’m happy that you are pleased that Q likes your ‘skills’ – though I’m not quite sure what skills are involved in making up figures from the top of your head and then being petulant when people pull you up on it.

sfsa78 says:
“So if scientology isn’t a religion, what is it”

Ask the countries that don’t recognize it as a religion.

“if its debatable, then any religion is debatable.”

That’s your opinion.

“Scientology is a form of faith/belief system.. I think it is you that does not comprehend.”

Where did I say it wasn’t? Try reading before replying, although I don’t think even that will help you.

“All form of faith are belief in the supernatural, and make belief.
1+1=2.. You don’t need faith or emAan to believe in that.”

What does this have to with anything I said?

@Lizq8… thanks for the info… I didnt know some of that stuff

@cytonic… i think the expats living in Kuwait wont be able to get drinks from hotels either because they have a residency visa, so in order for it to be implemented, instead of asking for ID to check your age, they would ask for ID to check what kind of visa you have

Mark, that wasn’t the statement I made at all. The statement was that 33% of Americans who claim to be affiliated with a religion are Muslim. However, I do admit (because the US Census no longer asks this question) it’s a close estimation based on government record keeping.

And though I didn’t post links, I did provide the source of the information three times. This isn’t a number I pulled from the air, or even calculated on my own… nor would I ever claim to. This is a figure provided to us by a variety of government agencies.

Furthermore, if Christianity were not defined by a number of religions (Catholic, Baptist, etc), Islam would be the most practiced (for lack of a better word) religion in America.

@American Girl,

This is ridiculous. What State Department report from 2001? Post a link. State the name of the report. It’s not that difficult.
Your 33% is quite clearly not a close estimation. You are blatantly making it up. It is just laughable that you are still pushing this figure.

And yes, Christianity has a great many denominations, but your remark that Islam would be the most practiced religion in the US if these were counted separately is yet another obvious falsehood from you. Exactly how many Roman Catholics do you think there are in the US for starters?

Look, I’m not American. I couldn’t care less if Muslims constituted 100% of the US population. What I do care about is someone peddling complete nonsense on the internet and trying to mislead others in the process.

You, American Girl, are an ignoramus.

@ moe jr. I like reading yr stuff. U always keep an open mind! Blogs about expressing opinions and learning not attacking people. Whether you legalize booze or not it’s still in q8! My maid was raped by 2 Kuwaiti boys who were drunk and they had done it before sober! Booze is not to blame it’s the people! I have local friends who obtain their booze from the very people who have banned it here! I personally am ok either way. I enjoy my trips to UAE and Bahrain.

I think the fact that these kind of threads always go the same the way makes this a very depressing time.

“If you don’t like it GTFO”
“Alcohol is life’s source, Kuwait needs it”

Pretty much sums up the entire discussion. The fact of the matter is there is always going to be two sides to all of these discussions, the sad part is why we cant seem to accept that. Why does one person have to be right? Can’t each argument have it pro’s and con’s and we all just MOVE ON…

@Lizq8… you need to have an open mind in this day and age, anything close minded nowadays is kinda considered a form of extremism by some people… booze is not to blame for a lot of things that happen, if you take it in moderation, i think you will be alright… i like to think of it as junk food, the more you have, the more it harms you… i also believe if a person is good sober, he/she will most likely not get drunk, unless of course they go into temporary insanity or something

Unlike australia (where i am now, be back in kuwait next month), kuwait does not have a district strictly for bars… the places people go for entertainment are more family orientated, and i think no family would like to go out and see drunk people or people smelling of alcohol walking around where their children go.. i think that is a major concern

people are comparing kuwait to the UAE and Bahrain, ive never been to bahrain so i cant say anything about it, but from what i know about the UAE, it has districts made for bars, correct me if im wrong cause i dnt drink, just what i heard

@Moe Jr.
good point regarding the districts. In fact, to support your argument, there is an issue in Kuwait regarding the residence of bachelors.

Since a lot of families are complaining about their area’s increas of bachelor pads, they are calling for a district to be made for these bachelors. And correct me if I’m wrong but I think that is in the works.

Tweez…i like to correct myself..unlike others who throw themselves into other people’s discussion to make a useless, stupid, and just plain WRONG statement..and then not own up to it…i was talkin to someone else when u razzait wayhik and made that “kuwait’s constitution does not say kuwait is a muslim country” statement of urs..
oh..maybe i dont make sense to YOU, but i never had that complaint by anyone else..maybe the fact that ur a kindergarten dropout has something to do with it?? ya i guess so..get some education..its never too late =D

“In order for Kuwait to move ahead, it must legalize alcoholic beverages.”

lolwut?

nations move ahead by becoming producers rather than consumers. technological advancements sets nations apart these days.
china gets it. india gets it. even isreal gets it.

legitimizing alcohol drinks ad the way forward? don’t make me laugh.. seriously.

Diesel..
Its a religion.. Get over it already! The church of scientology. Not recognising a religion? What r u on about.
germany is one country that doesn’t recognise it as a religion, they did this so that the religion won’t be tax exempt. Let’s apply the same logic of yours to;Remember, at one point in history germany didn’t recognise jews as human beings.. So is it debatable that jews are not human beings?
Iran doesn’t recognise baha’i religion. China doesn’t recognise the falun gong religion.
However, in a country where religious freedom is seen as paramount, like the usa, where all of these and including scientology are recognised as religions.

Deisel, It is YOU who needs to read. Go educate yourself.

American Girl: Why do you on keep spreading inaccuracies around? US has 51 million catholics and 36 million baptists compared to 1.3 million muslims(or say 5 million as per CARE)and some other denominations with more adherents that that of Islam. Even the muslims are divided between Shia, Sunni and other sects.
Indian: I am not against Islam. If someone states that 33% Indians are buddists, would you not counter that inaccuracy?

One question : why not legalize alcohol and give people the choice to drink or not? If youre muslim and think its haram, dont drink.If you want to drink, drink! After all, Nobody can force you to pray or fast, or go on a haj.Its up to you and your interpretation of the qoran and Islam.

Another point I disagree with is this fear that if alcohol is readily available, suddenly everyone in kuwait is going to turn into some sort of monster rapist alcoholic. Why assume thats the case? 1) alcohol is already available and anybody can buy it. 2) How come this didnt happen in the UAE,Bahrain,Egypt,Syria,Lebanon,and all other countries where alcohol is legal?
3)The whole ‘government cant tax it since its haram money’ is ridiculous. A lot of the biggest listed kuwaiti companies that the government has shares in already have restaurants and hotels all over the world that serve alcohol.So the income and profits of those companies that come back to kuwait are already in existence.

Look around people. Doha has the Tribeca Film Festival and 5 of the best american universities like John Hopkins.Abu Dhabi has the F1 and a Louvre and concerts by some of the biggest artists in the world like Prince. Bahrain has its own F1.Dubai gets 30 million tourists a year.
What do we have here? Hala Febraayer and a dozen empty hotels. I know its a bit off topic, but in the end its all related and they go hand in hand. The brain drain from Kuwait has been increasing more than ever before and its time to drastically change the antiquated laws and beliefs that have got us nowhere.

@bazaar… in regards to your 3rd point, about the tax thing…. most people dont know about that (i for one didnt) but i think it would bother more people if it started happening in their own backyard, they dnt care if its happening in someone else’s yard

but i agree with you… let it be legalized and become a choice that comes down to the individual, most wont do it cause they’ll be worried about their reputation… funny story, i knew a friend who flew to spain, via amsterdam, he wouldnt drink in the plane cause “people on the plane might know him or his family” but once he got off for the transit, straight to the pub

@tweez… i know people are complaining about the bachelor’s increasing, but didnt know they were making districts for them

Wow mark congrats … One hell of hornets’ nest stirred up here…. It got everything Religion, Politics, scandals in the making and finger pointing. Only thing missing here is the sex which then would make an excellent Daniel Steele novel for my wife to pick up 😉
Now to the topic of this post; Alcohol to be made legal or not… we have our equal aye and nay sayers but to use religion as an excuse is just plain wrong. Case in point Dubai, Oman, Bahrain, Egypt, Jordan all equally Arab and Islamic or some may say Muslim countries…. yes?? All equally allowing consumption of alcohol?? But do they have runaway crime sprees based on alcohol related crimes?? Do they have citizens who I am assuming are Muslims reeling, swaying and swaggering in the streets out of drunken stupor?? I haven’t seen any in my time … matter of fact the Omanis, Emiratis and Egyptions who I know and some who are close friends are some of the most decent respectable people on earth I know. I have many Kuwaitis who are both friends and colleagues who fall in this category. Now do they drink???????? 6 out 10 yes they do…. most of them have a broad sense of thought and choose to drink… that’s right they CHOOSE to drink … it on the table in plain sight….. nothing hidden and no one forcing it down their throats. This is what it boils down to….. Choice…. Free will….. Thoughts that separate us from the animals.

Christian, Muslim or Jew it doesn’t matter. Alcohol is forbidden in all three religions. In the old testament of the Bible consumption of pork and alcohol is a sin, In the Quran it’s an outright sin and the same as in the Torah. Now does that stop people from drinking alcohol and eating bacon?? I don’t think so. And one would be a complete fool if he believed so. If it were to be made legal would it boost tourism in Kuwait?? Maybe …Most likely yes…. Now some may disagree and say no way and that we can have tourism without it.

Now considering what Kuwait has in terms of tourism that would entice me as a tourist let’s compare and see… hmmmm Malls?? I’d rather shop in Dubai at least I can enjoy a cold alcoholic beer with a steak at TGI’s after that long grueling day shopping in a MALL!! Restaurants … they have some decent ones here in Kuwait and quite nice fancy ones as well but a glass of wine with my meal or some champagne on a really special occasion to celebrate would make it even nicer. The Water Park??? There are some amazing ones out there in the international world but I am not picky so I would go to the next closest thing to it…. And that’s right next door in the Arab World which would be Atlantis in Dubai and I can still have a screw driver right next to the pool….. The Zoo?? That would mean having actual exhibits of the animal world so if that was on my mind I’d fly down to San Diego.

So in the end it’s a matter of choice and free will. If you feel it is HARAM and WRONG stir away and decline the offer for a drink. If its business or pleasure and your company is a must then order a fruit juice or a club soda the other party will not be offended matter of fact they will have more respect for you. I know I do.

When one is brought to respect another’s choice and way of living without comparing and comprising his own values , culture and self respect then that person has nothing to fear.. Be it alcohol, bacon or the White Devil as we are most lovingly referred as.
Remember everything has consequences…. On earth jail time or worse if you are a complete horse’s ass and go crazy and drink without limits …. Or a pain full death through liver sclerosis. In the spiritual realm you answer to God. We all will have to answer to our respective makers some day. I most likely may burn in hell for my wine drinking and bacon eating ways but it’s my choice made by me freely and not forced on me.

So stop using religion as a valid excuse for anything. Because honestly it’s not.

And to all on this blog my apologies for the sermon 🙂

“So stop using religion as a valid excuse for anything. Because honestly it’s not.”

Uhh, yes it is. Islam forbids drinking, trading and even smelling or touching alcohol. If the government imports alcohol, it will make profit. Since that money is used in many different ways INCLUDING pay checks for those who work in the government sector, that is HARAM money. Now let’s assume private food companies import it rather than government. You go to your TGI Friday’s and they’re selling alcohol. The waiter/waitress is muslim, the manager is muslim, the people working in office are muslim, etc etc etc. TGI Friday’s makes profit from selling alcohol and not only are the people working getting paid for that, they’re also increasing the company’s profits by working for them. Which, yet again, is haram money.

Maybe some of you Muslim don’t care because you’re “so open minded” but for those of us who actually still follow Allah’s book (and apparently there’s so few of us left) we rather not be involved in any of this.

@security advisor….FYI Alcohol is not forbidden by all religions. After the old testament came the new testament. Jesus drank wine with his 12 apostles in the last supper…. A ritual performed in church during service in the catholic church. Some Christians don’t drink but some do. Getting drunk is against Christianity as is over indulging in anything…food, shopping etc. Also Jews do drink. Wine is also very much part of their religion.

American girl is posting under lots of different names congratulating her silly posts. Lol. So pathetic!! And busted!!

Loooool

Check out the development of My Country – the UAE, it could never have been done without respect and liberal attitudes toward different religions and cultures.

sfsa78 says:
“germany is one country that doesn’t recognise it as a religion, they did this so that the religion won’t be tax exempt.”

The “Church” of Scientology has been tax exempt in Germany since 2003, and doesn’t explain why other countries, such as France, also don’t recognize it.

” Let’s apply the same logic of yours to;Remember, at one point in history germany didn’t recognise jews as human beings.. So is it debatable that jews are not human beings?”

So, now you’re comparing Nazi Germany, who had a political agenda, to a progressive Democratic Germany?

Let me make this easier for you. Do you believe that everyone believes, without a doubt, that Scientology is a religion, or do you believe that some have a differing view, which would make my original statement true?
*waits for the obvious answer even a juvenile would know*

@ Lisq8

Thanks for the update. Now you know why I dont go for confession coz the preists are any always buzzed 😉

In any case I am still screwed and gonna burn coz even though we are allowed to drink coz Jesus drank wine we are still not allowed to get drunk…….. And I always over induldge and get drunk.. just ask the wife.. and again my personal choice 😉

I think that some people here do not get the big picture of this matter. The problem is people are trying to seperate religion and politics which is causing this great debate about legalizing alcohol and having free will. Islam is the religion which kuwaiti people follow, and by follow i don’t mean that we only pray to god when a loved one dies, or when a doctor tells us we have one year left to live. We muslims pray 5 times daily, whether we are in good or bad conditions. So religion is part of our everyday life, whether we are eating or going to sleep we always remember Allah. At the same time the government rules our life also, by giving us jobs, benefits, health care etc. So how can we seperate the two ? As a Muslim i would not accept money from the government if i knew the selling of alcohol was behind it. We as Kuwaitis will not accept a government which will not follow the Islamic sharia.

Also, there is this great misconception from foreigners that most Kuwaitis drink. That is not true, the only reason you feel this is because the Kuwaitis that have relationships with foreigners are very liberal. And for the people who are trying to push their claim for legalizing alcohol, i have lived in London for 13 years, and have lived and made friends with people who drink; and i have never seen anything positive from drinking, neither health wise or pleasure wise.

@David,
Apologies, if you seen that as offensive. I do not think that you are crazy or against Islam. I was bit sarcastic as to why somebody is responding to someone who are making baseless statements without any real value. Not only this topic but other topics as well. Just see the red crescent campaign video topic as well

Assumptions and “I am sure” statements are something to be not addressed is what I intended. anyone is free to comment anything, but should we respond to everything? especially if it is without clear evidences, when it demands for it

Took me one hour to read through this argument. The funniest part is when the heated argument between American girl and Funny was up and Mark comes in giving links to his posts. LOL.

I’m not sure if the 33% is right or wrong. But I know half the people have misunderstood her statement to be “33% of US is Muslim” which is no where around what she is saying. Regardless of that, I agree with her argument that Kuwait needs to be Kuwait, there shouldn’t be special rules for visitors, expats or citizens regarding alcohol.

@Kulsum,
You are not sure if American Girl is wrong? She is wrong. Hugely, comically wrong. Rosy has already posted the data. She and I both fully understood what she said, which was that 33% of Americans who profess a religious affiliation are Muslim – a statistic that is hopelessly inaccurate. And your post is one of the reasons why I keep responding to her comments; She is actively misleading people who might just take her comments at face value.

@Abdulrahman AlQemlas

you said: “We as Kuwaitis will not accept a government which will not follow the Islamic sharia.”

Speak for yourself and go to Saudi or Iran if that is what you want.

@ flux … هذا رأي و لي حق اني اقوله، سواء عاجبك ولا مو عاجبك. و افضل اني اكون شريف ولا اكون انسان مالي شرف.

..suddenly being drunk and ‘raping sprees’ are being quoted in the same line.. …never heard of a terribly drunk rapist.. …the physics just don’t add up.. …who am I to know.. i could be dead wrong..

they should only legalize beer so people can get use to it. if it works out fine they can sell the hard stuff 🙂

@Abdulrahman AlQemlas
what do you mean by saying that? Or are you just saying stuff randomly?
9ij ma 3indik salfa ya faylasoof zamaanik!

at the end of the day, it is up to the government and it is up to the individual to control himself or else he/she will answer to the law.

You see???????? TweeZ gets it. All those comments and sermons…aahem cough…cough from certain individuals ….;-0) and TweeZ puts its up in a nice clean statement and sums it up in a nut shell .. Good on ya TweeZ .. you and me can grab a drink togather anytime…. Again completely YOUR choice 😉

@ Lizq8

Lol I hear you.. I’ll save you a seat at the best table closest to the cold beer if I get there first 😉

This is just an afterthought… & yes I have plenty of free time 🙂

@ Othman Al-Othman I just gave your earlier comment a little more thought
like this particular gem

“Uhh, yes it is. Islam forbids drinking, trading and even smelling or touching alcohol”

Now I agree with this completely as it is mentioned in the Quran. What I am leading to is can you clarify if this means that you do not associate yourself with people not necessarily trading in but who consume and smell alcohol???

What I mean is in your everyday life in your place of work or business do you only mix around with people who are of your faith, who don’t consume, smell, touch alcohol and are of the same thought process?? Or do you in your daily life come across other human beings of other nationalities and religious faiths?

Chances are not all will be Muslims and you are more than likely to run into a sinner like me who drinks alcohol and eats bacon. Now considering I won’t have sinner or white devil tattooed on my forehead will you refuse to shake my hand and say hello?? For sure you will think to yourself he is not a Muslim so will you automatically hold back your hand or hold it up to your nose and say HARAM alcohol drinker or bacon eater?? Or will you take it and say Kali Waly this is business and the modern world and life goes on??

I am sure you have travelled to the US, Europe or the Far East for business or pleasure and when you do; do you only fly via Saudi Airlines just to ensure no sinner is flying the plane or serving you your meals?? Do you ask the waiter or waitress at a restaurant when you are in these countries wether he or she consumes alcohol before they serve you just to ensure that the plates they touch are not tainted?? What about the cook who cooked the meal?? Maybe he or she had nice cold one before coming in to work that day?? And in business before accepting a cheque when you close the deal do you ask the same?? 9 times out of 10 both parties traditionally in those parts of the world go out for dinner and drinks to celebrate the closing of a successful deal or venture. So what do you?? Do you insult them and decline and say Fk it I don’t care about the money and business or say well since it’s a part of the deal & your presence is required I will accompany them, have a fruit juice or a club soda talk business and not compromise my self-respect and values?? You make me wonder if ever when pigs start to fly,it snows in hell & alcohol becomes legal in Kuwait will you up and leave the country and move to KSA which any ways has the highest record of consumption of Black Label in the world??

@Al Qemias… The kuwaiti’s that I know who drink are NOT married to foreigners. They drink but they don’t tell their wives. You have a misconception of the Kuwaiti people. There are a lot but won’t admit it to another Kuwaiti. Not saying that this is a reason to legalize booze but thought you should know. Also I was in Lebanon when I met a family from Kuwait whose wife wore the nakab. We stayed in the same hotel. Next night I came back to find hotel staff trying to get him out of the lift as he had passed out drunk!

@Othman Al-Othman
Yes, I do and here I come.

There is lots of things the government is already doing to make money and is considered HARAM. e.g. (1) Health Insurance (2) Refusing land for Church (3) Turning a blind eye on Companies who don’t pay its employees. All this money is used by YOU, yes YOU Othman Al-Othman.

Yes Islam forbids drinking, trading and even smelling or touching alcohol “as you say”, but just because you don’t drink, don’t think that others READ KUWAITIS don’t drink. So if you don’t want it, just look the other way.

That’s why I said, SPEAK FOR YOURSELF.

@Abdulrahman AlQemlas:

loooool. jad i6la3 minha. oo il7imdilla 7okoomatna ma tamshy 3al sharee3a, chan il kil ra7 feeha.

I repeat … Most people in Kuwait are religious and don’t want alcohol, otherwise it would have been legalized a long time ago. Liberal people like tweez and flux are thankfully the minority. I am just saying this so that expats understand why it’s illegal… Because some people here are causing confusion, they are making expats think that most kuwaitis want it legalized, this is very misleading. “WE” don’t want alcohol legalized, end of story.

@Abdulrahman AlQemlas

you said: ““WE” don’t want alcohol legalized”

Budy, when will you ever learn to speak for yourself. Instead of saying “we” say “I” because obviously you do not represent all of Kuwait.

And as for your statement: “Most people in Kuwait are religious”….tokfa, get out of your house and smell the corruption.

@Security Adviser
I guess people are intentionally being ignorant about the subject and refuse to see it in a different perspective.

@Security Adviser,

I haven’t read everything you wrote but I got your point. I do not mind mixing with people who drink. it’s their own business, not anyone else. Come to think of it I mix more with people of other faiths, cultures and nationalities than that of mine 😛 What I DID mean by my comment is those of us who choose not to consume alcohol, whether it’s for religious or personal reasons, prefer not to walk into a diner and having to smell alcohol, etc. Islam is this country’s religion and it forbids it and so I choose not to take part in it. It’s simple as that. I have nothing against anyone, they can drink all they want, just don’t force me to go against my religion.

—————-

@freespeech

Just because the government is already corrupt doesn’t mean you should make it worse than it already is. My initial comment was in reply to Security Adviser’s comment and referred to people such as myself who’d rather not allow alcohol to be used in Kuwait. Ya3ny I’m talking about people like me, not YOU. I don’t care if Kuwaiti’s already drink, it’s no “secret” so ur not telling me anything new. I could care less who you are or what you think, I’m not here to represent you nor Kuwait so mind your own business and stop posting these “speak for yourself” comments.

Security Advisor,

The answer is “secularism”.

Europe and the United States, and almost any “advanced” country progressed that way, Europe was living the dark ages because the Church forced or brainwashed people into religion, or connected everything to religion, including science, they stood against any progress if it was against the Church’s thoughts. Once the church slowly started losing its control over the government, those countries started progressing in almost all aspects of life.

The sole most important gift god has given us (if you believe in god) after the gift of life, is the gift of free choice. And no one, and I mean no one has the slightest right to revoke that right from you. That’s why I believe secularism is the answer, you have the choice to become the most devoted religious person on this planet, or a the choice to become an atheist and spill buckets of “sins” as long as none of that directly hurts the society you live, just like what god wants.

Shall I dare say that if it wasn’t for secularism, there won’t be any Muslims or maybe just very few in the Western world today? How is that some might say? I’ll leave that to you.

Unfortunately, this won’t happen as long as a big chunk of the society think that if you’re a secular Muslim, then you are an Infidel. All thanks to those

@Nael, Well said.

@Abdulrahman AlQemlas, ” I repeat … Most people in Kuwait are religious and don’t want alcohol, otherwise it would have been legalized a long time ago”

You’re dead wrong by saying “most people in Kuwait are religious” don’t generalize speak for yourself. Second, alcohol was legalized a long time ago.

@Othman Al-Othman, “Islam is this country’s religion and it forbids it”

Just because a countries main religion is Islam does not mean it forbids it. I believe Security Adviser has already mentioned a good list of Arab countries whose main region is Islam and yet they have alcohol.

It’s up to the country’s government to say whether it is in or out.

@ DarkWolf80s

I didn’t say anything about Kuwait. I said ISLAM FORBIDS IT THEREFORE I CHOOSE NOT TO TAKE PART IN IT. Ya3ny the reason I don’t drink is because my religion commands me not to. My comment was written for Security Adviser. If you don’t understand what I’m saying or perhaps enjoy skewing my words up don’t get involved into our conversation please. It’s really that simple.

——-

@ freespeech

Are there any other words in your dictionary other than “speak for yourself”? What do you not understand about the phrase “I’m not here to represent you nor Kuwait”? Is this a reading comprehension issue you have? Not understanding ANYTHING I say? Seriously dude you have a problem.

Abdulrahman AlQamlas..bro, u should listen to those idiots..dont say “we”..say “i”..cuz moo kil el nas itkhar allah..so if u wanna say “we”..say “we, the kuwaitis who fear God”..cuz lil asaf akoo kuwaitiyeen emsaween roo7hom “cool” o “open minded” and theyre not like the rest of us who still recognize el 7alal wil 7aram

@Othman Al-Othman

No dude, it is YOU who DO NOT UNDERSTAND. Did you even finish Kindergarten? Did the doc delivering you DROP YOU on your head?

LOL. Judging by your poor grammar and inability to comprehend basic English language you obviously STILL don’t understand what I’m saying. I’m done replying to you.

@Spartan
what’s “7alaal” is that you leave people alone
what’s “7araam” is that you butt-in other people’s business

and “we” fear God, but “we” don’t fear people like you. So please, stop calling others idiots if you truly are a “god-fearing” person. Learn to respect others and their opinions like a “true muslim” would.

@ lizq8 … sorry, when i said relationships, i meant any relationship, like a friend, colleague etc. Yes i do realize that there are many kuwaitis who drink and won’t admit it, and i know many Kuwaitis who do, but that doesn’t make them the majority.

I will repeat and say “WE” because i represent the majority of Kuwaitis who don’t want alcohol legalized, and this is a fact. Otherwise you would find it legal.

@ flux .. all you seem to say is speak for yourself, i have spoken for myself. But it seems you still haven’t. What is it exactly that you want? and why? at least make an effort to prove your point.

@Othman Al-Othman, Religion and country are two different things. You should have made your statement clearer by just saying “Islam forbids it” rather than saying “Islam in this country.” I am not skewing anything because if I am then any of our neighboring Gulf countries should have banned alcohol a long time ago.

@Abdulrahman AlQemlas – Othman and Spartan:
Why are you guys even using the internet? THe internet harbors porn and other filth which is “7araam” in Islam, so why are you using it?

Shit!! Where did American Girl go… comments arent coming in anymore.. I was enjoying reading the arguments… bag o popcorn, chilled shani, (would have loved a beer though) it was all set.. sadly it fizzled out…
Mark – did this post reach or outnumber Latina Mina episode comments? :p

In the end, its the country’s govt choice… and what they decide, everyone will have to adapt to the new rules… but before legalizing alcohol, there are more important matters

stop censoring movies in the cinema and use the universal rating system for example :p

@ al Qemias… I agree with everything you say except an argument about majority ruling. Why should we always go fo majority here. If USA went with majority instead of minority there would be no mosques in USA. This is about personal choice and people living together. Again it’s my personal opinion. Like I said earlier, either way I will continue to drink and enjoy spending my money outside Kuwait!

@Othman
I know, wow, but that is besides the point. What I am trying to get at is that the internet harbors porn and other stuff that are “7araam” and one can send viruses and hack into computers and cause massive financial and emotional harm to others.

HOWEVER, you as a person, have a CHOICE in whether to indulge in such activities or NOT. But more importantly, you as a sane person can make that judgement of what is right or wrong according to what you believe and nobody can judge you. Why? Because you have the right to choose.

Also HOWEVER, if you hurt others by hacking and sending viruses or passing rumors, there is a law that can punish you for that choice!

Now, isn’t beautiful to live in a civil society, where an individual can make choice based on his judgement? I think most will agree.

“Furthermore, if Christianity were not defined by a number of religions (Catholic, Baptist, etc), Islam would be the most practiced (for lack of a better word) religion in America.”

@AmericanGirl – Are you serious? I wasn’t going to say anything, I was just going to enjoy the argument ya’ll have been having, but that is the most ridiculously uneducated statement ever. Where do you get your facts?

Lets break it down to the mini religions of Christianity – Total Christians – 76%

Of that 76% the breakdown is as follows:
Catholic – 25.1%
Baptist – 15.8%
Mainline Christian – 12.9%
Christian Generic – 14.2%
Pentecostal/Charismatic – 3.5%
Other Protestant Denominations – 3.1%
Mormons – 1.4%

Now lets look at the total of non-Christian religions

Jewish – 1.2%
Buddhist – .05%
Muslim – .06%
New Religious Movements & Others 1.2%

And what about atheists or agnostics? 15%
And lastly, those that did not respond 5.2%

After breaking it all down to individual religions (i.e. Catholic, Baptist, etc) please tell me again how islam would be the most practiced religion in America?

Where am I’m getting my math wrong? Do I need to go back to 2nd grade and learn how to add again because your statement is just not adding up.

@ TweeZ

That is not what I was discussing. I’m all for freedom of choice. However, that is not the case in this situation and besides the point I was trying to make. My point is simple and I’ve already said it many times yet no one seems to get it. According to Islam, money profited from the selling/trading/etc of alcohol is haram. Agreed? Now wait for it, that is still not my point. My point comes here…

Money that either:
A) Government
or:
B) Private company

makes from alcohol according to Islam is haram. Therefore, as a MUSLIM (This is capitalized for all the idiots who keep saying “speak for yourself”), I choose not to have any part in this money. Since that is the case, then I cannot work for any government sector OR a private company that makes money from selling/trading/etc alcohol. As such, my freedom of choice becomes very limited. Isn’t that what you wanted? Freedom of choice? I would have no problem if a bar opens and sells alcohol without ANY effect on those who do not drink or take any part in it.

Now, you said I use the internet yet it harbors porn so it’s haram. You make no sense. That’s like saying I cannot drink any fluid because some fluids contain alcohol and since that is haram then I shouldn’t drink anything at all.

@ lizq8 … Kuwait is ruled by a ruling family, whereas the U.S. is different. Countries with ruling families will almost always look to the majority since they do not want to instigate any sorts of revolution.

@ Tweez … The internet in Kuwait is regulated and monitored by the government, all porn, gambling, etc. sites are blocked. The internet is a world wide web, it is the world connected, so its normal that you’ll find the good and the bad. And we have the government to limit our access to the good, just as they are limiting the access to our beverages.

@Othman:
I’m glad that you are starting to see things my way…a bit. Anyways, with regards to your fluids analogy, you totally missed my drift on this one. The reason why I chose the internet as an example is because it is the closest thing to a society that everyone can relate to on this blog because 248am, with all its bloggers, are like an online community and Mark is the Mayor 😉
Anyhow, you as a person could’ve chosen to just download porn or hack other PCs….BUT YOU DIDN’T! Instead, you chose to have this lovely debate with the 248am community! You are interacting with live people and are enjoying your time on the internet with various online aliases.
Did you know that there are people that have an internet connection just for the sake of downloading movies and selling them in the black market? I am more than willing to bet that you and others have bought an “original” dvd for just a KD from these guys or have downloaded a movie without paying for it. Now correct me if I am wrong, but isn’t stealing a bigger 7aram than drinking alcohol? – Which by the way is makrooh and not 7aram because I have asked about it.
@Qemlas:
Right on. But, there are proxies who could enable a person to access these sites, right? And just like proxies, there are black markets. Both are unofficial channels that are not regulated that could get a person what they want.
And by the way, there are LOTS of educational sites that are blocked also. So that can’t be good.

@Othman:
You really think that the government is going to sponsor these beverages? Of course not!
It will probably be by a foreign-private company of sorts. And trust me, they don’t need you to work for them because odds are they are probably doing fine without you.

Booze, politics, lies, scandal. Oh my! It took me an hour to read all of this. I honestly can’t see or understand the fuss. I’ve been here 4 yrs and I’ve had drinks with everyone from shieks and diplomats alike. And I can honestly say Kuwait is under cover open, If you get my drift. I honestly think booze is not and won’t be legal because of the heavy Saudi influence here. Either way alcohol is and always be in Kuwait. How can you deter or even expect to ppl not to drink. When all of if not 95% of those with power do it??? Sounds hypocritical to me…

Othman Al Othman.

So are you saying that those “Millions” of muslims in the western countries who live their lives and get paychecks are receiving “Haraam” money? Because we all know that the government gets income from charging taxes on almost everything, including alcohol, So a muslim government official might be recieving a salary that is “stained with money profited from alcohol”
Also private companies might be trading in “Haraam” activities, especially banks? Are you saying that a Muslim who works for a bank in a western country who receives a monthly Salary is receiving a “Haraam” Salary? Because that bank might be paying him with money that it profited from interests!

My opinion? as long as the government is not running the “alcohol business” directly and not getting the profits straight up. I don’t see any problems with that, because I’m sure that the income which the government makes is not %100 “halal”.

Why aren’t there any scholars doing their jobs on advising millions of muslims on this matter if its that serious, Hell for eternity is no joking matter!

“So are you saying that those “Millions” of muslims in the western countries who live their lives and get paychecks are receiving “Haraam” money? Because we all know that the government gets income from charging taxes on almost everything, including alcohol, So a muslim government official might be recieving a salary that is “stained with money profited from alcohol”
Also private companies might be trading in “Haraam” activities, especially banks? Are you saying that a Muslim who works for a bank in a western country who receives a monthly Salary is receiving a “Haraam” Salary? Because that bank might be paying him with money that it profited from interests!”

Yes, yes and yes.

@ Tweez,

First off, alcohol IS NOT makrooh. It’s from the “kaba2er”. The 3 biggest mu7aramat are “shirk”, “zina” and “drinking”. I don’t know who you asked but that person is completely clueless. That is not a matter of opinion or point of view lol.
BTW, I still don’t get where you’re going with the internet analogy. i mean yes it’s all about making your own choice, which I agree with that. But that goes back to my argument on 7aram money and having limited choice as far as where your money is spent if alcohol gets imported here.

@ Nael, if a Muslim is forced to do something that will go against Islam (such as working in a restaurant that also serves alcohol) then only then will it be “okay”. However, if you can find a job where it does not go against the teachings of Islam then it is encouraged that you apply for such job. My previous answer of “yes” had more to it. Just wanted to add this piece of info.

The reason I’m arguing about this is because Kuwait is a Muslim country, where the majority of it’s law is derived from Sharia law (forget about the fact that some laws are broken and are against Islam like some of the banking systems here, that is not the point and is a whole other topic). As such, allowing alcohol would go against Sharia law and would only be constituted to please a minority. THAT minority also happens to be from a foreign country, ya3ny they’re not even Kuwaiti.

@O2
if an internet user is downloading porn or downloading movies so they could sell in the black market, then the internet service provider is profiting from “7aram” money 3ala goltik.

And who allows the intenet service provider to even exist in the first place? The ministry of Comm. Ie the gov. So it’s a big circle-jerk of pass the hot 7aram potato….for a lack of a better analogy 😉

With regards to the subject of Kuwait being an Islamic state or country, here are snippets from various constitutions that I can find online that share the same or remotely the same meaning to that of the first article of the Kuwaiti constitution:
UAE:
Article 6
The Union is a part of the Great Arab Nation to which it is bound by the ties of religion, language, history and common destiny .
The people of the Union are one people, and one part of the Arab Nation .

Article 7
Islam is the official religion of the Union. The Islamic Tiara’s shall be a main source of legislation in the Union. The official language of the Union is Arabic .
BAHRAIN:
Article 2
The religion of the State is Islam. The Islamic Shari’a is a principal source for legislation. The official language is Arabic.
QATAR:
Article 1
Qatar is an independent sovereign Arab State. Its religion is Islam and Shari’a law shall be a main source of its legislations. Its political system is democratic. The Arabic Language shall be its official language. The people of Qatar are a part of the Arab nation.
JORDAN:
Art.1 . The Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan is an independent sovereign Arab State. It is indivisible and inalienable and no part of it may be ceded. The people of Jordan form a part of the Arab Nation, and its system of government is parliamentary with a hereditary monarchy.
Art.2. Islam is the religion of the State and Arabic is its official language.
SYRIA:
Article 1
(1) The Syrian Arab Republic is a democratic, popular, socialist, and sovereign state. No part of its territory can be ceded. Syria is a member of the Union of the Arab Republics.
Article 3
(1) The religion of the President of the Republic has to be Islam.
(2) Islamic jurisprudence is a main source of legislation
KUWAIT:
Article 1 [Sovereignty, Territorial Integrity]
Kuwait is an Arab State, independent and fully sovereign. Neither its sovereignty nor any part of its territory may be relinquished. The people of Kuwait are a part of the Arab Nation.

Article 2 [State Religion]
The religion of the State is Islam, and the Islamic Shari’a shall be a main source of legislation.
What I’m trying to say is that all of respected constitutions above have common denominators with the Kuwaiti Constitution.
The reason why I believe that most people believe that Kuwait is an Islamic state or country is because Kuwait has a lot of Islamic propaganda and media influence compared to most other countries. This is all thanks to the government’s political appeasement to the Islamic bloc. Who, by the way, are responsible for all the segregation hoopla and other stuff that began implementing it hardcore ever since after the 1991 liberation.
Sorry for the sermon, but sometimes one has got to be very elaborative to get a point across.

@ TweeZ

If by Islamic you mean like Saudi Arabia where none of the laws applied must contradict the Sharia law then no. I don’t consider Kuwait to be at that level nor do I even want it to be :/

I was however pointing at the fact that Article 2 states the following:
“The religion of the State is Islam, and the Islamic Shari’a shall be a main source of legislation.”

With that said, Kuwait is not gonna allow alcohol as it’s a pretty big deal. Kuwait law already allows men to wear shorts, women to wear tight clothing / partially “revealing” even though it goes against Islam because they are not THAT big of a deal nor does Kuwait base all of it’s laws on Sharia law.

From interpretation of the phrase:
“The religion of the State is Islam, and the Islamic Shari’a shall be a main source of legislation.”

One can understand Islamic Shari’a plays a part, but does not necessarily need to be considered… the ‘shall’ adds a whole new meaning

@Othman
Alcohol was legal in Kuwait until 1967 so keep in mind that is SIX years after the constitution was written in 1962.

So, by keeping these important dates in mind, one can see that the banning of alcohol was politicaly motivated. If it were a religious issue, then alcohol wouldn’t have been here in the first place…and I’m talking decades if not hundreds of years ago.

One issue that many of you might be familiar with might be segregation. In the mid 1990’s, segregation was not very popular. One can only imagine how very unpopular it was in the 1980’s-70’s-60’s etc. But today, it is applied like its a divine law. And if you asked others why you think this is so, they would say because of islamic principles while in fact it is a political decision to appease the Islamic political bloc of Kuwait – purely and nothing else.
So, like the banning of alcohol, segregation is a political move and not a religious one. Because if it were religous, then it wouldn’t have been here in the first place.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *