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Petition to Change Working Hours of Street Cleaners

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There is a petition currently circulating to shift the Ramadan working hours for street cleaners to the evening. The temperature outside is hitting 50 degrees and because its Ramadan they can’t drink any water so this petition makes complete sense. Over 10,000 signatures have been collected so far and according to the people who set up the petition, the signatures will be passed on to the municipality to help push for this change. So if you would like to support this petition, visit this [Link]

Update: Below is a video a friend shot. The working hours of the street cleaner she spoke to is 8:30AM to 10:30PM during Ramadan.


[YouTube]

Photo on top by Yahsheik

79 replies on “Petition to Change Working Hours of Street Cleaners”

They already have a law for that and there are inspectors checking to ensure nobody is working in the direct sun between 10am to 2pm. I don’t get the petition.

I think it is pretty barbaric to expect someone to work outdoors before 10 am and expect them to not drink water as well.

Great initiative.

However, a similar initiative to cut the hands off those who actually litter the streets and throw trash out of their car would also benefit us.

The other day, I saw one of these workers walking down the street picking up trash and this car stopped right next to him and it looked like the driver was giving him trash to throw out but instead he gave him a couple bucks and this worker’s face just lit up. It was amazing to see ’cause I’ve seen so many inconsiderate people throwing trash on the floor and just not treating them with the respect they deserve as HUMAN BEINGS.

Glad to see someone trying to make a change, these guys work long hours and are ridiculously underpaid. Also, somedays I’m pretty damn sure it’s a lot hotter than 50 degrees but that’s never really revealed officially now, is it?

Thanks for letting us know about this, I’ve signed and am gonna try and get other people to do it too!

I’m one of these guys that hands out money a lot (not bragging not like anyone knows me here just saying) anyway i stated this because this is not rare from Kuwaitis and happened plenty and the workers knows that (they search us at traffic lights/banks/etc pretending to clean a clean place sometimes lol)

I don’t blame them, they are underpaid honestly and in islam definition they are “maskeen” which has money to eat but barely anything else, the other day i saw a young lady front of me handing out money to plenty of people at every traffic light or bus stop (i was following her ma 3endy sho’3el lol)

I agree with Hassan. I’m American and I’ve lived in Kuwait for over 7 years. I never thought of handing out money to the cleaners, until I moved from Mangaf/Mahboulah area to my new neighborhood, which is mostly Kuwaiti. I saw so many people here handing out money to the cleaners in the morning, so I do the same thing now from time to time. I now notice them pretending to clean and gazing at cars near the traffic lights! For some reason traffic lights and speed bumps areas are always dirty and need cleaning. I don’t knock their hustle though. We all know these folks work hard and are underpaid, so we can all help by being a bit charitable from every once in a while and help these people out. Us expats need to give these cleaners money too. A KD or two goes can make some of these guys day.

A worthy petition but do you know why the webpages for the effort are relatively anonymous? (i.e. doesn’t give details about who is gathering the data for the petition and what will be done with it)…

Aren’t they supposed to work in the evening in Ramadan anyway?! I mean… their working hours already shifted in Ramadan. I wonder if those in the sun are actually cleaning the streets or its just another way of begging.

Well its not like they have a car. These workers get shuttled from their accommodation to their area and then back when its over. So if they’re on the streets they were put there.

You are correct. But there is a huge “underground” business is involved there… For example, who gets on which bus to work in what area, which corner of that area, etc. For example, those who work on main streets or near traffic lights actually pay “someone” to end up there. Usually that spot is more pricy than that of inner streets. Likewise, it costs more to work in a residential area within the capital than that outside the capital with expats as majority.

This is something everyone knows about and everyone keeping quiet because it makes everyone happy. The street cleaners get something on the side, whoever put them there (huge chain of people) get their cut too, the management running the company end up with somewhat happy staff and we feel good about ourselves for doing something good and giving out something.

You know, today I had a convo with our home driver… he had me laughing a little and made me realize that life is still very good in Kuwait. See, we don’t have much work at home so our driver ends up with plenty of free time. The dude decided to buy a minibus and work on his free time. Which is of course illegal, but something many expats do on their free time.

He got stopped by police couple weeks ago, and was sent to the capitals traffic department jail. I’d expect some 3rd world treatment… like from inhumane treatment to poor water and so on. Its funny how he was laughing about that couple of days prison stay!! First, they were put in a clean prison cell, new bed mattress, new pillows, and new blankets… they were fed three meals a day, sandwiches and tea in the morning, meets (red meat, chicken, and even fish!) for lunch… and kabab for dinner! They had like 3 air conditioning units in their cell, and at ever corner there was a power outlet so they can charge their mobile phones! His own words… that was better than anything anywhere! His only problem? he didn’t like his cell mates! LOL of course.

Oh, he ended his story with indians, bangali, and egyptians getting released very quickly for having wasta.. but Kuwaitis had to stay for many days because they weren’t accepting wastas for Kuwaitis! interesting. though not unexpected. lol

by the way…

I know about the street cleaners details because one of our driver cousins work there.

Cut the hands ? Lol. That’s a brilliant one .would sort the traffic problems too . What an idea mister.

I guess there is hotline numbers to report if any employer is making labors work under direct sun after 11 am. It works pretty well too.

The guy in the video explained that he came in a bus from (near) the farwaniya hospital. I didn’t really understand exactly what he meant by that.. So to answer some of your questions, they were just dropped off at these random parking lots and there’s no one there to pic them up until 10:30 at night..

Why doesn’t someone do some investigative journalism and follow them and their busses. Track where they live and make a real documentary about their lives and living conditions? That way it my expose some truth if you are so interested

Why doesn’t someone do some investigative journalism and follow them and their busses. Track where they live and make a real documentary about their lives and living conditions? That way it may expose some truth if you are so interested

On my way to work everyday in Ahmadi i passed by couple of street sweepers/cleaners looking so miserable.. Those companies who brings them here should face some serious consequences of being so inhuman. Not only putting these poor workers under heat but taking most of their paycheck. I saw a photo of one cleaner under a tree who was reported dead due to extreme heat and thirst.. God help them.

You’re not “just curious”, you think this is a clever way to undermine their point.
It doesn’t matter if these two individuals aren’t being screwed over, because withholding the pay such laborers are entitled to is a common practice. Your “sly” objection here isn’t going to make a jot of difference to the fact that this happens and it happens a lot, regardless of whether or not it’s happening to these two individuals specifcally.

Personally I’m “just curious” as to why you even bothered 😉

u curious that most of their paychecks are taken..
(by ‘most’ ‘May’ meant a percentage of their entitlement)

Even a retarded brain should be able to figure that a percentage of their entitlement is hogged by their employer…’robbing the poor to feed the rich’….These workers are paid low salaries…so much so that they had to fight for their rights some years back to get their salary to a reasonable level..

It wouldn’t be surprising that most of them are still underpaid…while their managers and employers are grabbing chunks of their entitlements…and you dont have to be sherlock or einstein to determine that…just ask any cleaner about his working conditions if you are in doubt…its not a picnic for them…

And imagine their heart when they see people moving in air-conditioned vehicles while they are out in the heat, working…Do you sincerely think that their employers/animals wouldn’t be stealing from their entitlement already?

are you supporting/defending the employers of the cleaners? It seems that are you are incapable of either sympathizing/empathizing with the gross working conditions that the cleaners have to face.

Put yourself in the place of the cleaners and imagine their condition..there are genuine people here who are willing to do good..so stop trolling their efforts..

You’re confusing being underpaid and have their salaries withheld or taken. The underpay part is a topic open for debate for all ranges of pay, for all kinds of jobs all over the world.

As for not having their salaries… I ask you again, on what bases are you accusing large companies of withholding salaries of thousands of their employees? And how do you justify the workers silence if this is indeed a common practice? And why their embassies or human rights organizations are not taking any actions?

Just wondering, hope you can answer these questions rather than astonishing us with your avoidance skills.

Hilarious accusation coming from the guy who conveniently skipped over my reply.

You make an interesting word choice – “justify”. As if, should they be TOO AFRAID or unable to complain (as is actually the case), then they deserve to be taken advantage of.
And that really tells us all we need to know about you, doesn’t it?

“Whenever I hear anyone arguing for slavery, I feel a strong impulse to see it tried on him personally” – Abraham Lincoln.

3azeez, everything you’ve contributed on this threat, however veiled, makes me think of this quote. Since you seem to be so pro labourer and the rest of us are either exaggerating or confused, I wish their lifestyle on you at some point.

As other posters have also hinted, these cleaners (mostly Bangladeshis) actually pay to get prime spots for their ‘cleaning’ activities. AFAIK, there are road-sweeping machines that do most of the grunt work of sweeping the roads in the nights, and these chaps hang around near the red lights waiting for alms givers during Ramadan. This is again a mafia at work – though the givers in this case have a choice to give or not to give, unlike the trolley mafia operating in the airport. For all that we know, we may see these ‘poor souls’ actually petitioning the Baladiya for their right to ‘clean’ streets during daytime 🙂

So you think the street cleaners are an organized mob who are raking money in dealing dope on every street corner and are all just acting piss ass poor to fool us dummies?

I am not suggesting that the street cleaners are dope dealers or anything like that. Although this is an organized job, in this case, the giver has a choice to give or not to give unlike the way it is with the airport trolley gang. But, generally, many road users do tend to be quite generous to these workers, especially during Ramadan- as I can see regularly from my vantage sun-gazing point (!). In the morning rush hour, for example, I have seen many cars stopping by to give some tips to the cleaner who hangs around in front of my building. On Saturdays, these numbers only go up. After the traffic thins down (after 10 am), I see the same guy(s) hanging around with the apartment caretakers in my block. To sum up, it’s unlikely that these workers are being forced to work in the hot sun during Ramadan- rather, they seem to do so because it is financially rewarding, by their standards.
Peace; Ramadan Kareem
P.S: FYI, this issue of the cleaners paying their supervisors to get posted in certain spots was also discussed in a newspaper article a couple of weeks back (Arab or Kuwait Times- not sure).

The workers (street cleaners and airport trolley guys) are exploited and extremely under paid, they have nothing. If I was them and during Ramadan realized people are more charitable I would also stand around at traffic lights trying to make more money. It’s survival and if you think you’re the one thats being taken advantage you’re delusional.

Street cleaners come to Kuwait with nothing, after working here for 10 years they leave Kuwait with enough money to buy a home, car, family and education in South Asia.

The Kuwaiti dinar is the highest valued currency in the world. They’re not underpaid by South Asian standards, Kuwaiti KD is worth more in South Asia. Street cleaners are benefiting alot from the exchange rate

Seriously? Ok lets do some calculations. If these guys put aside KD50 a month (they absolutely don’t put that much aside but lets say they do). After 10 years thats KD6,000. Could you please tell me where in the world I could buy a home, a car and fund my kids education for that amount?

Kuwaiti KD is not worth more in South Asia, it’s worth the same everywhere in the world, its a currency. If it’s worth $3.55 in the US then it’s also worth $3.55 in South Asia.

Bangladeshi cleaners can buy a house in Bangladesh after working in Kuwait for 10 years

The ignorance of some people is astonishing!

mark,its legalized slave labor…and unfortunately many of the locals (and some expats) live in denial of that simply fact….

In Bangladesh, you can.

KD6,000 is quite aspirational for a worker from that country. It can get you an used car (sub-1 liter), a 1000 sq.ft house with basic amenities, and government subsidized education upto college level (typical family size 3 kids), with some cash still left over for old age. A joint family will need a bigger house, but then, there will be other family members also who chip in with cash or ‘sweat equity’ in the form of labor for building the house. A Kuwaiti Dinar in Bangladesh apparently goes a longer way than it would in the 1st World.

Also, please remember that the earning horizon for a South Asian (a Bangladeshi in this case) in Kuwait is far more than 10 years – it’s more likely to be 15-20 years. After reaching here on a cleaner visa, most Bangladeshis usually manage to work their way up from their shaky beginnings in Kuwait, “buying” their transferable visas, and shifting to office jobs as tea boys, cleaners etc. This means that your saving estimate needs to be raised higher.

The money to pay for all this flows from an ‘underground’ economy where ‘maskeen’ cleaners pay others to get their traffic signals to clean, or the porters paying for the right to extort trolley charges from the passengers at the airport- or by collecting commissions for issuing visas to other job seekers in their own countries. Myriad opportunities do exist- for the exploiters and the exploited alike- at the bottom of the pyramid in Kuwait.

The core issue remains that if you spot yellow overalls ‘working’ on a hot day, it is very unlikely that these persons have been forced to work there by their employers. As long as we keep giving to redeem ourselves from the guilt of enjoying a comfortable life in Kuwait, you can expect to see these persons in the streets. So it is doubtful whether signing this mass petition will ever take these persons away from the hot sun.

This comment is by Abderahman https://248am.com/mark/kuwait/petition-change-working-hours-street-cleaners-2/#comment-745934

As I said earlier to 3azeez, I wish this life on you and yours at some point since it is so great.

Since you’re so great with the financial planning, I’m sure you’ll be able to afford double what the Bangladeshis have!

The heart behind the petitioners is in the right place, but the sympathies are not.
For all the street cleaners or porters whom we see “toiling” in the hot sun, there are countless others who work largely unseen and at the mercy of their individual employers, and so escape our sympathetic gaze… the farmhands, shepherds, the gardeners, the scrapyard workers… I would even include the gas station attendants in this category because they work outdoors from dawn to dusk. These are the people who do deserve our kindness because they are exploited and underpaid relative to the work they do. And they don’t have a choice, as compared to the street cleaners.Is there something we can do to help these ‘unseen’ worker categories?
Try this simple test if you have the time: When you spot a cleaning worker ‘sweating’ it out near a main street or a red light, take a tour around the blocks in your own area and see for yourself: how many cleaners can you spot in the low traffic streets or the trash dumping grounds in your locality? If the cleaners were really at work all day, would there have been any cause for the Mayor of Salmiya (lol) to lament about the squalor there?
Peace

Abderrahman, please shut up. You’re giving a bad name to kuwait with your ignorance. You should be ashamed of yourself for actually making those mesakeen cleaning the streets some kind of evil masterminds looking to suck all of kuwaits money. You’re retarded and your parents raised you better than this.

I think 3azeez works for the ministry of labor. Either that or they are just a jerk who doesn’t care about people being treated like people. Yeah I said it. No one wants to hear your pro profit anti labor law crap.

I think 3azeez and abderahman works for the ministry of labor. Either that or they are just a jerk who doesn’t care about people being treated like people. Yeah I said it. No one wants to hear your pro profit anti labor law crap.

Its really funny and sometimes sad to see how many of you attack those who partially disagree with you. The level of tolerance on this blog is AMAZING!!

I read so many negative comments directed toward me in this post as many posts before… despite the fact that I do agree with some of the key points raised in this blog entry…!!

Its amazing how someone accuse others of being ignorant… while themselves are practicing ignorance with making such claims and showing lack of sight and knowledge to the whole issue under discussion.

Now, I would like to respond to Mark’s comment where he stated “Ok lets do some calculations. If these guys put aside KD50 a month (they absolutely don’t put that much aside but lets say they do). After 10 years thats KD6,000. Could you please tell me where in the world I could buy a home, a car and fund my kids education for that amount?”

Fact: Street cleaners are paid at or above the minimum wage. So they are paid above 50 dinars.

Fact: Their employers provide them with accommodation, transport, health care, and three meals a day (before you start yamming, the three meals are often done through restaurants which will agree to provide three meals at a fixed price paid per month… the employee would receive that amount in cash with his salary so he can pay to the restaurant or any of his choice as many restaurants in areas where expats workers concentrate offer this kind of arrangement).

Fact: Street cleaners work in that job for half a day only. Most/Many (if not all?!!) are working on second jobs such as cleaners/porters at Ministries, hospitals or baggers at coops… some work as part time gardeners or house boys.

Fact: Street cleaners are not supposed to sweep the actual streets. There are cleaning vehicles that does that. Street cleaners are supposed to clean the side walks… being Kuwait, Side walks are mainly occupied by cars and used as parking spots. Also, they are mostly being cleaned by the house maids.

People just bring arguments out of their asses. I stated all of the above based on physical contact with the people that actually do these jobs… we have talked face to face. I know them from work, our coop, some worked for our neighbors and I stated before some are related to our people. But I guess its not “nice” to talk without drama… just like that Muroor jail and our driver experience… it was such “good” and “unreal” experience that people would just call it a lie and move on.

Fact as it stands, there are so many haters that no matter what you do for them, they’ll always hate everyone, everything and they probably even hate themselves!

:/

Hey 3azeez, first of all you’re stating facts but not linking to any sources so they’re just hearsay for now like everyone elses comments here.

But in any case if you read my comment you would note that I did not state the minimum wage was KD50. What I said is that if those street cleaners saved KD50 a month then in 10 years it would amount to KD6,000. My question wasn’t for you but for insom who said workers after 10 years end up moving back home, buying a car, a house and educating their children all with the savings they made while working in Kuwait. I wanted to know where I could do all that for just KD6,000.

Well, Mark, in Bangladesh, you can.

The sum you mention is quite aspirational for a worker from that country. It can get you an used car (sub-1 liter), a 1000 sq.ft house with basic amenities, and government subsidized education upto college level (typical family size 3 kids), with some cash still left over for old age. A joint family will need a bigger house, but then, there will be other family members also who chip in with cash or ‘sweat equity’ in the form of labor for building the house. A Kuwaiti Dinar in that country apparently goes a longer way than it would in the first world.

Also, please remember that the earning horizon for a South Asian (a Bangladeshi in this case) in Kuwait is far more than 10 years- it’s more likely to be 15-20 years.After reaching here on a cleaner visa, the resourceful ones- this means most of them – usually manage to work their way up from their shaky beginnings in Kuwait, “buying” their transferable visas, and shifting to office jobs as tea boys, cleaners etc. This means that your saving estimate needs to be raised higher.

The money to pay for all this flows from an ‘underground’ economy where ‘maskeen’ cleaners pay others to get their traffic signals to clean, or the porters paying for the right to extort trolley charges from the passengers at the airport- or by collecting commissions for issuing visas to other job seekers in their own countries. Myriad opportunities do exist- for the exploiters and the exploited alike- at the bottom of the pyramid in Kuwait.

The core issue remains that if you spot yellow overalls ‘working’ on a hot day, it is very unlikely that these persons have been forced to work there by their employers. As long as we keep giving to redeem ourselves from the guilt of enjoying a comfortable life in Kuwait, you can expect to see these persons in the streets. So it is doubtful whether signing this mass petition will ever take these persons away from the hot sun.

Apologies for diverting from the main topic, but just thought of sharing what I have learnt from my interactions with this class of workers.

Peace

Abdelrahman.. hope u keep the cleaners home countries economy in mind. There is something called inflation. Not necessarily ppl in their families back home are working too. There are may with sickness ridden parents leave alone kids education. But to some who said that the dinar is much valued in their countries and they can buy a house etc,is kinda ruthless to say so. As their subsidies in limited to certain things and there is alot of corruption there , so the things they get is adulterated and so on. Hence they looks for a better life in terms of food medicine and education ( it’s safe for anyone to wish that upon themselves right ? And I’m not speaking luxurious obviously)
These ppl are fooled by their agents back home with a package and dreams of a better life.which i guess they mean central a/c at their accommodation here. And their agents take a big sum of money from them to get jobs abroad.
Yes these workers are fools to agree to these offers and sell their farms jewelry etc to come here and not get what they were promised making them vulnerable to do some illegal jobs and part time elsewhere (which I believe is illegal too becoz if the cops catch them , they would face dire consequences)
End of the day all said and done .What Does everyone think these cleaners minimum wages should be ? + Including their supposed facilities they get here.
Reality check ppl.its an expensive world now.

@Mark, I know what you said. My answer may have been long but at the time of writing it I thought it was answering some of the questions. What I was trying to say is that those people are definitely earning more than what they were contracted to earn from their cleaning jobs. Indeed they are a very hard working people, they are living a very tough life with two jobs and many other things on the side. Bottom line is, lets not make assumptions. I don’t have to prove anything to anyone and no one has to take my word for anything. I stated clearly where I got my information… I’m sure anyone can have a small chat with anyone just like I did.

And by the way… whoever started the petition… did they really care about street workers and their wellbeing? Are they really collecting our data to help street workers?

To my knowledge, a petition is what you do when all fails. Have they approached the cleaning companies first? There is a union of some sort that includes all cleaning companies. If the union rejected… the union speaks to the Municipality… did they talk to the municipality??? Municipality operates under direction of the Council… whose representatives are elected by people… and people have leverage on their representatives, thus the Council actually has power over the municipality… has anything been done there? I highly doubt it.

This whole petition thing is questionable.

Having said that, if this event has helped identify and channelize the energies of 10000 compassionate individuals in Kuwait (and their families, perhaps) who believe in helping their less-privileged fellow beings, that itself is a great thing.
Best wishes

Having said that, if this petition-signing event has helped to channelize the energies of 10,000 compassionate individuals in Kuwait (and their families, perhaps) who strongly believe in helping their less-privileged fellow beings, that itself is praise-worthy.
May bigger causes come your way.
Best wishes

That whole video is shady…

First, its a Kuwaiti girl, speaking in English. Why? The street cleaners know Arabic very well because they mix with most of the local population which is Arabic speaker. Did she speak in English because she is targeting a specific audience?

The video started with HER telling the street cleaner his working hours. She didn’t ask him and give him chance to answer. Maybe she did before the video started… we don’t know. But the way the video presented, she was putting words in his mouth. And the man could very well say yes to whatever she wants just to get some cash from her. He may have meant 8:30 am to 10 am? I don’t know.

A street cleaner best hope for cash is women… for many reasons be it they’re kinder than men maybe? Because once a woman on her period she has to pay cash for every day she’s not fasting? because maybe… just maybe… she’s driving a very nice BMW! Who knows?

hmm…

Mark, feel free to believe whatever you want.

@3azeez …why don’t you go and work for K.D 50 in that hot son and see how well you do?
And stop being bothered about those who give tips to those workers.
Many of those workers are abused by their companies, they don’t get their salaries on time. They are just given accommodation but not food. There are hundreds of Companies in Kuwait who do this. I can see how ignorant you are about the reality on the ground. This sort of a Racist,non-merciful attitude does not suit you to call yourself a Muslim.
And finally the Oil you think is yours does not belong to you , it belongs to the Muslim Ummah because the Prophet SAWS prayed for a source of wealth for the whole Ummah and not for a selected few. people like you are an insult to the Arab & Muslim nation.

I’m for this.
I’m also for not having laws against people eating and drinking in public during the day in Ramadan.

You’re supposed to find fasting difficult. Forcing people who may genuinely need to eat/drink not to do it because you don’t wanna see it is ridiculous. And if they’re supposed to be fasting? That’s none of your business. You can’t always tell who is healthy and who isn’t.

In ALL Gulf Arab states, there’s a law against public eating during Ramadan

Maybe Kuwait has to leave the GCC because its a GCC wide law

In Yemen and Iraq, similar laws against public eating during Ramadan

Dubai has a law against public eating, it’s illegal to eat in public in Dubai

Lebanon is not a GCC Arab country

40% of Lebanese people are Christians

80% of Kuwait’s total population is Muslim

So what. Even if it was 99%. Since when does someone’s religious belief give them a right to control what others do…Oh wait all organized religions do crap like that. Besides what better test of your resolve then to actually let non Muslims live their lives while you fast without having to worry about being tempted. The Dubai Mall was serving food during Ramadan last time I was there during Ramadan. Also I am Muslim and don’t care if others aren’t fasting around me.

It is illegal to publicly eat in Dubai

They have a few restaurants where it’s legal, but in 99.9% of Dubai, it’s illegal to eat in public

I don’t agree with this law. It is a GCC wide law

I think a law forbidding people from eating in Ramadan is one of the most stupid laws ever. Diabetic people need to eat and drink… They are excused medically and pardoned by Islam. Why shame them and make their lives difficult? Muslim women on their period are required NOT to fast, they are allowed to eat. These are examples of Muslims that are allowed to eat during Ramadan. Non-Muslims are not required to adhere to Islam rules and I don’t recall ever hearing that in Muslim culture or history having to force people from other religions to practice Islamic activities or to forbid them from practicing their bleifs. Why force them to fast like us?

I truly believe that whoever requested and defended that law is a very weak Muslim who is questioning his faith and wanted everyone to be forced to fast and did not want to see food in front of him because he has no will of maintaining his fasting.

I spent many ramadan’s over the past six years abroad in non-muslim counties. If anything, seeing people eat and drink only made me more proud of my fasting.

Nothing to take personally but as “D” above mentioned , there is a reason behind the fasting. Sadly the governments all over are putting in ridiculous laws when there are many expats and non Muslims residing in the same country.

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